Throttle Body Relearn Procedure? - Drive Accord Honda Forums | radio-pro.ru
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post #1 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
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Throttle Body Relearn Procedure?

This is the first time dealing with a Honda & the first time with an electronic throttle body.

So I ended up doing something I'm not suppose to do, which is clean the throttle body while installed & connected. Ever since I stuck my fingers inside the throttle body/open the valve to wipe down with a rag.....my throttle response is....crap/hesitant.

I saw a few Youtube videos after telling me to disconnect the battery (negative) and clean TB after it has been removed from the vehicle. In short the electronic TB has programmed sensors which can get screwed if you push the valve open while connected to the power source.

They spoke of a "relearn procedure", but was not able to find anything concrete for the Honda. All for Ford & Toyota.

Need help with this one, or I am just going to buy a new TB Assembly from Honda which is only about $90. So it's not too bad.

Thanks in advance guys!

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post #2 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 03:18 PM
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Try looking for idle relearn procedures and that might help you.

I'm in a meeting but if i remember, it was something like disconnect the battery, reconnect. Turn on car. Hold RPMs over 2K RPM for five minutes or until the cooling fans come up three times then let idle for a few more minutes.

This is what they did on my wife's 2011 CR-V back when the throttle body has issues and needed replacing.

Hope that helps!

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post #3 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G.one View Post
This is the first time dealing with a Honda & the first time with an electronic throttle body.

So I ended up doing something I'm not suppose to do, which is clean the throttle body while installed & connected. Ever since I stuck my fingers inside the throttle body/open the valve to wipe down with a rag.....my throttle response is....crap/hesitant.

I saw a few Youtube videos after telling me to disconnect the battery (negative) and clean TB after it has been removed from the vehicle. In short the electronic TB has programmed sensors which can get screwed if you push the valve open while connected to the power source.

They spoke of a "relearn procedure", but was not able to find anything concrete for the Honda. All for Ford & Toyota.

Need help with this one, or I am just going to buy a new TB Assembly from Honda which is only about $90. So it's not too bad.

Thanks in advance guys!
It looks like you need to reset the PCM then run the idle learn procedure. The problem is you can apparently only reset the PCM with the HDS, so you might be better off bringing it to the dealer and seeing if a tech can step out and preform the procedure:

1.
Make sure all electrical items (the A/C, the audio, the lights, etc.) are off.

2.
Reset the PCM with the HDS.

3.
Turn the ignition switch to ON (II), or press the engine start/stop button to select the ON mode, and wait 2 seconds.

4.
Start the engine. Hold the engine speed at 3,000 rpm without load (M/T in neutral, A/T and CVT in P or N) until the radiator fan comes on, or until the engine coolant temperature reaches 194 F (90 C).

5.
Let the engine idle for about 5 minutes with the throttle fully closed.

NOTE: If the radiator fan comes on, do not include its running time in the 5 minutes.

6.
Turn the ignition switch to LOCK (0), or press the engine start/stop button to select the OFF mode.

7.
Jump the SCS line with the HDS.

8.
Wait 60 seconds, and exit the SCS mode with the HDS.

You might be able to do it without the reset but that's what Honda docs say to do. It also says that the idle learn procedure needs to be completed after the throttle body is cleaned.


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post #4 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G.one View Post
This is the first time dealing with a Honda & the first time with an electronic throttle body.

So I ended up doing something I'm not suppose to do, which is clean the throttle body while installed & connected. Ever since I stuck my fingers inside the throttle body/open the valve to wipe down with a rag.....my throttle response is....crap/hesitant.

I saw a few Youtube videos after telling me to disconnect the battery (negative) and clean TB after it has been removed from the vehicle. In short the electronic TB has programmed sensors which can get screwed if you push the valve open while connected to the power source.

They spoke of a "relearn procedure", but was not able to find anything concrete for the Honda. All for Ford & Toyota.

Need help with this one, or I am just going to buy a new TB Assembly from Honda which is only about $90. So it's not too bad.

Thanks in advance guys!

Disconnect both battery cables. Jumper the positive and negative cables together. and let sit for 10 minutes. If you dont have a jumper wire to do this, just clamp them together with a set of vice grips. this fully discharges all capacitors in the entire vehicle. Then reconnect your battery terminals. While your doing all this make sure the cables dont touch the battery terminals. You might want to lay a fender cover over the battery to be safe. Start the car and make sure ALL YOUR LOADS ARE OFF!!! no ac, no lights, no electrical loads. Let the engine run WITHOUT touching the throttle until you hear the cooling fans cycle twice.

(Honda says 15 minutes for an idle learn, but i personally let the vehicle go through an entire warm up cycle when i have to do it on one of my customers cars. people might tell you im to cautious, but thats fine with me)

Also, a small trick with the cooling fans. Before you start the car, mark on of the fan blades with a sharpie. That way you can walk away from the car and dont have to sit with it. If the marked fan blade is in a different spot, then the fans came on at least once while you were gone.
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post #5 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 06:37 PM
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And then reset the radio code, right?
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post #6 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by greyhonda View Post
And then reset the radio code, right?
Radio codes, memory seat positions, basically any personal information settings. To be honest i forget if phone settings need to be done. When i do this procedure its typically during major engine/engine performance repairs. (i wouldnt do this procedure after a evap repair or something not performance related. but after correcting a lean/rich condition, or replacing an engine or major component, i reset the ECU and do the idle learn. either way, im not concerned with the customers phone settings. So if they go out of whack then its up to them to sync there phone and do all that bullshit that sales should have taught them to do during the purchase. (but who am i kidding, without fail people buy the car and show up the next week asking a flat rate tech to show them how to use their phone. sigh.....)
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Last edited by crmplex; 07-14-2015 at 07:50 PM. Reason: forgot info
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post #7 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nayr14 View Post
It looks like you need to reset the PCM then run the idle learn procedure. The problem is you can apparently only reset the PCM with the HDS, so you might be better off bringing it to the dealer and seeing if a tech can step out and preform the procedure:

1.
Make sure all electrical items (the A/C, the audio, the lights, etc.) are off.

2.
Reset the PCM with the HDS.

3.
Turn the ignition switch to ON (II), or press the engine start/stop button to select the ON mode, and wait 2 seconds.

4.
Start the engine. Hold the engine speed at 3,000 rpm without load (M/T in neutral, A/T and CVT in P or N) until the radiator fan comes on, or until the engine coolant temperature reaches 194 F (90 C).

5.
Let the engine idle for about 5 minutes with the throttle fully closed.

NOTE: If the radiator fan comes on, do not include its running time in the 5 minutes.

6.
Turn the ignition switch to LOCK (0), or press the engine start/stop button to select the OFF mode.

7.
Jump the SCS line with the HDS.

8.
Wait 60 seconds, and exit the SCS mode with the HDS.

You might be able to do it without the reset but that's what Honda docs say to do. It also says that the idle learn procedure needs to be completed after the throttle body is cleaned.


Im not 100% on this, i can look into if people are that interested, but i DO believe that performing the full system reset procedure (jumping pos and neg cables for 10-15 minutes) resets the PCM. I know that fuel trim values revert to 1.00, DTC's and Freeze frame data is cleared, and all the readiness codes read "not ready" which is a sign that it does. Also on a pilot the power tailgate controller gets reset, on an odyssey the power sliding doors are reset, on every car the Auto up and down power windows are reset, and the list goes on. When iv done major engine work, the battery is typically out of the car, and i dont manually reset the ecu with the HDS. I have NEVER had an issue. But again, i wont say im certain unless im certain. But i know that cleaning a throttle body, then relearning the idle as i told him to should not be a problem if he doesnt waste money at a dealer for someone like me to hit a few buttons on my keyboard and charge $60. (.5 hrs of my time)

Im in no way being combative here, im just stating my opinion.

and hey, OP, your gonna have to relearn your AUTO up/ AUto down power windows too. You can use the search feature on this site, or for your convenience just PM me and ill walk you through it without ridiculing your for not using the search button.
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post #8 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crmplex View Post
Im not 100% on this, i can look into if people are that interested, but i DO believe that performing the full system reset procedure (jumping pos and neg cables for 10-15 minutes) resets the PCM. I know that fuel trim values revert to 1.00, DTC's and Freeze frame data is cleared, and all the readiness codes read "not ready" which is a sign that it does. Also on a pilot the power tailgate controller gets reset, on an odyssey the power sliding doors are reset, on every car the Auto up and down power windows are reset, and the list goes on. When iv done major engine work, the battery is typically out of the car, and i dont manually reset the ecu with the HDS. I have NEVER had an issue. But again, i wont say im certain unless im certain. But i know that cleaning a throttle body, then relearning the idle as i told him to should not be a problem if he doesnt waste money at a dealer for someone like me to hit a few buttons on my keyboard and charge $60. (.5 hrs of my time)

Im in no way being combative here, im just stating my opinion.

and hey, OP, your gonna have to relearn your AUTO up/ AUto down power windows too. You can use the search feature on this site, or for your convenience just PM me and ill walk you through it without ridiculing your for not using the search button.
It might, but the Honda docs typically list the manual procedure if a HDS is not available (and the manual procedures get pretty crazy), and if I check the article there is no manual procedure listed. Also it request that you jump/short some connection at the end. Not sure what that does.

It's worth a try to see if it fixes the issue without bringing it to the dealer, but if it doesn't I'd head straight there.

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post #9 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 08:10 PM
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What is the proper way to clean the throttle bodies on this car?
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post #10 of 27 Old 07-14-2015, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by nayr14 View Post
It might, but the Honda docs typically list the manual procedure if a HDS is not available (and the manual procedures get pretty crazy), and if I check the article there is no manual procedure listed. Also it request that you jump/short some connection at the end. Not sure what that does.

It's worth a try to see if it fixes the issue without bringing it to the dealer, but if it doesn't I'd head straight there.
Your right i have never seen the battery terminal reset procedure as a published "honda procedure." But is commonly used and often recommended by Techline during the diagnosis and repairs of "glitchy" ECU issues. You can trust me when i say that its legitimate. but again, i cant say for certain that it resets the ECU. Also, your right about honda usually listing another option if the HDS isnt available. I guess im so used to overlooking that option cause i always have one ready to go. the SCS connector your talking about can be used to flash codes, and i think to enter certain ECU's into self diagnostic modes, ect. To be honest, iv never used it. LOL. 9-10 years now. never even touched the god damn thing unless i was at the training center. even then i went about it knowing i would never need it. shame on me for that.

At this point you all got me so curious i have to know now. LOL I'll look into wheather or not the ECU gets reset during extended NO voltage conditions at work tomorrow.

But as i said before, the fact that Fuel trim data and readiness codes being reset is a good sign that the ECU has been reset. After all emissions and fuel economy have become top priority, therefore not easy to discard.

do you work with cars? you seem to know alot about these things.

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post #11 of 27 Old 07-15-2015, 06:58 AM Thread Starter
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Crap, I have no idea what to do LOL.

No ones instructions seem to be concrete.

I hate taking a car to the dealership, cause something else is always wrong after.

Would buying a new TB fix this problem? or would I have to do the relearn procedure with the new one as well?

Only asking due to the Youtube videos stating that after cleaning TB, relearn procedure must be completed after installation.




EDIT: Just spoke with the Honda Technician. Even with a new TB installed, relearn procedure would need to be done.

Looks like, i'll be going to the dealer for this.

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post #12 of 27 Old 07-15-2015, 07:11 AM
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had no idea we need to clean that piece ?? isnt it inside the intake tubing? should'nt be dirty if you have a clean filter no ?
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post #13 of 27 Old 07-15-2015, 07:18 AM
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There may be some grime in there due to the PCV vent tube. Some cars are worse than others with spitting oil back in, this is what catch cans are made to prevent. That being said, I've never thought to check mine, project for this weekend.
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post #14 of 27 Old 07-15-2015, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G.one View Post
Crap, I have no idea what to do LOL.

No ones instructions seem to be concrete.

I hate taking a car to the dealership, cause something else is always wrong after.

Would buying a new TB fix this problem? or would I have to do the relearn procedure with the new one as well?

Only asking due to the Youtube videos stating that after cleaning TB, relearn procedure must be completed after installation.




EDIT: Just spoke with the Honda Technician. Even with a new TB installed, relearn procedure would need to be done.

Looks like, i'll be going to the dealer for this.
If u pay for it, your wasting ur money. If u go to the dealer, they are gonna do the same thing I told u to do. Why? Cause I'm a tech at a honda dealer and that's how it's done. But do whatever u want.

Oh, and I did confirm that the battery terminal reset DOES IN FACT reset the ecu of done correctly.
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post #15 of 27 Old 07-15-2015, 08:10 AM Thread Starter
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If u pay for it, your wasting ur money. If u go to the dealer, they are gonna do the same thing I told u to do. Why? Cause I'm a tech at a honda dealer and that's how it's done. But do whatever u want.

Oh, and I did confirm that the battery terminal reset DOES IN FACT reset the ecu of done correctly.
OK.
Well I'll try your instructions to see if this will fix my throttle body.

Where can I find the radio codes? I've replaced my battery before and did not have to enter in a radio code as long as I turned the car completely on.


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