Fuel Injectors Upgrade - Drive Accord Honda Forums | radio-pro.ru
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Rating: Thread Rating: 2 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
post #1 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 05:30 PM Thread Starter
Aspiring Tuner

AccordLXMaster's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
location: Dallas (Mesquite)
Posts: 1,102
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Fuel Injectors Upgrade

im thinking about getting fuel injectors for my car..an upgrade at least....since i have an intake and somewhat of an exhaust. any good brands out there? I WILL NOT ACCEPT BOSCH...LMAO... i see NGK doesnt make em so i was wondering..not too big of an upgrade maybe like a level above stock. and if you kno the websites that would be great


265k and Running
Tons of Upgrades Currently in Progress...[3/31/16]

98 LX

ENGINE MODS
-Spectre CAI
-Flowmaster 40 Series
-NGK G-Power Plugs
-4-2-1 Header
-CherryBomb GlassPack Resonator
-JDM F23A Swapped

COSMETIC MODS
-Double 5% Tint
-Twin Halo Projectors
-Bright White LED Turn Signals
-DDM Tuning 6000k 35w

SUSPENSION MODS
-Megan Strut Bar

AccordLXMaster is offline
Advertisement

post #2 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 05:55 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
Won't make a difference at all with stock programming. Dumping extra fuel with larger injectors will make the PCM reduce the duty cycle on the new ones as the feedback system will keep the air/fuel ratio the way it wants it to be as if it had stock injectors.

And an intake and exhaust won't make much a difference anyway.


Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
post #3 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 06:34 PM Thread Starter
Aspiring Tuner

AccordLXMaster's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
location: Dallas (Mesquite)
Posts: 1,102
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
hmm...good point.. well i see i have to get a cam regrind for my engine so should i go for more high rpm or low mid rpm...as far as a general goal for the car as a whole...high rpm or low-mid rpm accord, which would the engine take easier and cost less?

265k and Running
Tons of Upgrades Currently in Progress...[3/31/16]

98 LX

ENGINE MODS
-Spectre CAI
-Flowmaster 40 Series
-NGK G-Power Plugs
-4-2-1 Header
-CherryBomb GlassPack Resonator
-JDM F23A Swapped

COSMETIC MODS
-Double 5% Tint
-Twin Halo Projectors
-Bright White LED Turn Signals
-DDM Tuning 6000k 35w

SUSPENSION MODS
-Megan Strut Bar

AccordLXMaster is offline

post #4 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 06:50 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
There are no "reground" cams for F23 engines that I know of. Maybe complete replacement cams.

With the VTEC system your car has, you are either a 3 valve or 4 valve engine. At low speed 1 of the 2 intake valves is only opened ever so slightly to improve swirl in the chambers, above about 2500 rpm, the 2nd valve is allowed to open all the way.

Your car is not what's considered a high performance Honda engine with low and high speed lobes on both intake and exhaust valves like the dual cam cars are.

You can go for a more aggressive high speed profile cam, but it WILL affect low speed idle, torque and emissions. It can also, depending on how aggressive the cam's profile is, cause the PCM to falsely interpret the loping as misfires, if you increase the idle to compensate, the PCM will see that as an excessively fast idle and code P0505, and start the fuel cut surge.

If you want to keep your F23, I'd skip cams and such, pull the head, get forged rods and pistons if available and turbocharge it. Then get a custom engine management system.

You'd be better off taking the F23 out and seeing if there are kits to put in the H22 or H23 out of a Prelude. There's much more potential there as far as mods and internal parts.

Btw, are you in an area that does smog/emission testing?

Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
post #5 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 07:02 PM Thread Starter
Aspiring Tuner

AccordLXMaster's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
location: Dallas (Mesquite)
Posts: 1,102
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
yes but..then again i dont really do the testing.lol..

and second no they dont have them reground but thats not what i was saying..i was saying that id have to send mine in to get it reground. since they dont have aftermarket cams for my engine..

and yes the H22 swap is something i had in mind. maybe just a H22 head and f23 block but ughh idk...i kind of like the h22.

and yes i know high performance will affect low performance...i pretty much know all of that but you did enlighten me to the PCM and the idle thing...hmm didnt think about that part.

and pulling the head and going forged sounds ok actually. thinking of porting and polishing and doing a full internals build and then turboing it. but if not then id just boost about 6psi and leave stock internals =]] (sarcasm)

EDIT: i asked on my other forum but ughh no answer... i was thinking about retarding the timing a little and boring the cylinders about .020" over going with high compression pistons and upgraded fuel system

EDIT 2: Bisimoto would regrind them

265k and Running
Tons of Upgrades Currently in Progress...[3/31/16]

98 LX

ENGINE MODS
-Spectre CAI
-Flowmaster 40 Series
-NGK G-Power Plugs
-4-2-1 Header
-CherryBomb GlassPack Resonator
-JDM F23A Swapped

COSMETIC MODS
-Double 5% Tint
-Twin Halo Projectors
-Bright White LED Turn Signals
-DDM Tuning 6000k 35w

SUSPENSION MODS
-Megan Strut Bar

AccordLXMaster is offline
post #6 of 14 Old 11-18-2009, 10:26 PM
AC6DN

Bruce Hawkins's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2007
location: Bay Area (Santa Cruz), Ca
Posts: 1,403
Thanks: 22
Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts
So at WOT, stock injectors dont saturate? If so, wouldn't slightly larger injectors, get you more power?

If I was redoing my F23-A4, (assuming keeping it mostly stock) I'd port the intake/ head and Exhaust (port match), nothing radical. Headers ceramic coated (CARB approved type), and rapped (keep the heat in (ULEV), CAT back, and CAI. I assume, I could get more than 10 HP, less than 30 HP, could be realized...

Bruce - AC6DN:
Honda Accord, 2001, 2.3L (L4), F23A4, 4D EX - My main car…
Ford Taurus, 1992, 3.8L V6, - Trany prob's
Toyota 4x4 Extra Cab Truck, 2.4L SR5, 22RTE (Turbo) 1987, I still have.
Honda Accord, 1984, 1800cc? L4,
Plymouth Arrow, 1978?, 1800cc?, L4 (POS)
Chevy, Monza, 1976, 350cu, V8, My funnest car, think muscle car, poorly made...
Olds Starfire? 1975, 231cu odd fire, V6,
My first car, 1965 Chevy Impala 283cu V8, (I got during the mid 1980)
Bruce Hawkins is offline
post #7 of 14 Old 11-19-2009, 04:53 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
Any car's stock injectors shouldn't be run at any more than 80% duty cycle. Putting larger flow injectors in, will result in more fuel per pulse, but the PCM will see this via the air/fuel sensor, and lean the engine back to what it wants.

They will be damaged (electrically) if held open more. There are instances when some people mod and end up maxing the stock injectors. They start pintle bouncing, which results in fuel dripping, poor patterns, etc.

On the F23, I don't think I've ever seen anyone actually open up and mod the engine by doing stuff.

Wrapping the header you speak of will result in cracking over time. It does keep heat in though. A bit too much. Are there even carb approved headers for the ULEV?

Master,

If you retard the timing, which btw isn't adjustable, (no slots) will reduce your power. If you retard the CAM, you'll end up with both retarded timing (ignition) and retarded cam timing which will reduce low end power dramatically for a small gain on the high end. But with the retarded ignition timing, it'll take away any of that.

Boring any Honda .020" is borderline on the unsupported open deck liners. There's not much between the aluminum and iron liners.

I'd like to see these reground cams, how much material do they take off them, and are you able to set valve lash properly afterwards. Many reduce the base circle of the cam to do this.

Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
post #8 of 14 Old 11-20-2009, 04:16 PM Thread Starter
Aspiring Tuner

AccordLXMaster's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
location: Dallas (Mesquite)
Posts: 1,102
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
retarding the cam yeah you know what i mean..lol but i see you cleared that up. would only make a difference if i was using like an RV cam huh?.

well whats the max that you would suggest boring the f23a1? and stroking it? thinking of intertwining hod rod basics with tuner basics. and afterwards slap a turbo (maybe) and have a 2800 lb beast..lol.just a goal

yeah ill see for you..have to ask around..

265k and Running
Tons of Upgrades Currently in Progress...[3/31/16]

98 LX

ENGINE MODS
-Spectre CAI
-Flowmaster 40 Series
-NGK G-Power Plugs
-4-2-1 Header
-CherryBomb GlassPack Resonator
-JDM F23A Swapped

COSMETIC MODS
-Double 5% Tint
-Twin Halo Projectors
-Bright White LED Turn Signals
-DDM Tuning 6000k 35w

SUSPENSION MODS
-Megan Strut Bar

AccordLXMaster is offline
post #9 of 14 Old 11-20-2009, 04:47 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
If you're going to boost it, don't bore it at all. The weak spot in these engines are the tops of the unsupported bores. Any detonation under boost will break the tops of the jugs right off.

Not sure on stroking these either, there's not much in parts availability to do so. Internal clearances are very tight between rods and girdle and rods and balance shafts.

The only way you can effectively use something like adjustable cam gears, is if you have a DOHC head with TWO sprockets. Then you can adjust each cam individually for whatever type of power you want. And you'd need an adjustable distributor to reset base ignition timing.

Mixing and matching heads when not in the same engine family can be a pita at best, impossible at worst.

The F23 is not like the current J series V6, where you can mix and match most any J series parts, like cranks, rods, pistons, cams, heads, intakes, etc.. The A4 and up engines have the integrated manifold heads, which if you look have a nice square bolt flange that would work well for twin turbos with enough room.

Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
post #10 of 14 Old 11-20-2009, 05:33 PM
AC6DN

Bruce Hawkins's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2007
location: Bay Area (Santa Cruz), Ca
Posts: 1,403
Thanks: 22
Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts
So Fred,

I thought the resin Accords were the most stolen cars in the US, was that the VTEC engine was soot after (by tuner kids). What I hear you saying, is there are no mods available, for the F23 engine??? I'M confused???

Bruce - AC6DN:
Honda Accord, 2001, 2.3L (L4), F23A4, 4D EX - My main car…
Ford Taurus, 1992, 3.8L V6, - Trany prob's
Toyota 4x4 Extra Cab Truck, 2.4L SR5, 22RTE (Turbo) 1987, I still have.
Honda Accord, 1984, 1800cc? L4,
Plymouth Arrow, 1978?, 1800cc?, L4 (POS)
Chevy, Monza, 1976, 350cu, V8, My funnest car, think muscle car, poorly made...
Olds Starfire? 1975, 231cu odd fire, V6,
My first car, 1965 Chevy Impala 283cu V8, (I got during the mid 1980)
Bruce Hawkins is offline
post #11 of 14 Old 11-20-2009, 06:10 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
If I remember the 5th gen was the most stolen for a long time, is it now the 6th gen?

The F23s are usually dumped for the H22 or H23.

Any twin cam 4 cylinder vtec engine is more sought after than a sohc. Look at the prices that are commanded for things like the H, B18C, B18C5, and the F20C. The more popular, the much higher the prices go.

Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
post #12 of 14 Old 11-20-2009, 07:16 PM
banned

Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,170
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fredsvt View Post
If I remember the 5th gen was the most stolen for a long time, is it now the 6th gen?
FredSVT:

Not per what my State Farm insurance agent tells me. 1994-1997 Accord is still the preferred target for many thieves. Reason given: Easier to steal. Why? Unlike Gen Six, the Gen Five cars do not have the Immobilizer Anti-Theft System.
12153 is offline
post #13 of 14 Old 11-21-2009, 02:24 PM Thread Starter
Aspiring Tuner

AccordLXMaster's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
location: Dallas (Mesquite)
Posts: 1,102
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
oh well alright looks like the F23 is pretty solo in the car industry. not many parts that are interchangeable or that fit the f23..i should just go for the h22 huh?..but the F23 is a lil more torquey than the H22. what about the H23?

265k and Running
Tons of Upgrades Currently in Progress...[3/31/16]

98 LX

ENGINE MODS
-Spectre CAI
-Flowmaster 40 Series
-NGK G-Power Plugs
-4-2-1 Header
-CherryBomb GlassPack Resonator
-JDM F23A Swapped

COSMETIC MODS
-Double 5% Tint
-Twin Halo Projectors
-Bright White LED Turn Signals
-DDM Tuning 6000k 35w

SUSPENSION MODS
-Megan Strut Bar

AccordLXMaster is offline
post #14 of 14 Old 11-21-2009, 03:07 PM
Moderator

Fredsvt's Avatar

Join Date: May 2004
location: Morganville, NJ
Posts: 4,373
Thanks: 0
Thanked 22 Times in 18 Posts
The H23 is very mod-able, the only thing you don't want to do is bore OR hone the cylinders. The H23 uses a carbon fiber/aluminum liner. Without the proper tools and techniques you can wreck the bores in a heartbeat.

Usually when someone wants to boost one of these the liners are machined out of the block and a full "closed deck" set of liners are installed. However, it is usually isn't necessary.

See this:

Sapphire blue '04 V6 6 speed w/ full HFP, comptech ss, momo shadow, TL-S 27.2h/20 bars, intake spacer, retro chrome MH1 HIR2 highs, hella DE fogs, EBC Ultimax, subwoofer/amp, infinity rears, HD Radio, aux adapter, navi conversion.

Vermilion 1999 SVT F150 Lightning, Sylvania/Visteon Xenarc HID headlamps, '01 L turn/marker lamps, PIAA fogs, '01 up Bilstein shocks, all Pioneer speakers, Clarion subwoofer. All Redline fluids.

Silverstone 2003 Honda S2000, bone stock
Fredsvt is offline
Advertisement

Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Drive Accord Honda Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
The answer to the random question may be found under the Off Topic section of the forums and in the "Drive Accord Forums" category.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Linear Mode
Rate This Thread:



Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

For the best viewing experience please update your browser to


Related pages


rims walmartmtx 4002nissan maxima dash kithow to reset homelink garage door openerhonda aha radiovsa and abs lights on honda accordmugen si rims1993 honda civic batterycode p0420 honda accordh9 bulbshonda civic oem floor mats2014 honda accord exl v6 reviewhow to install carbon fiber wrap5x110 rims and tirescost to replace calipers2006 civic si clutchdealernet hondawhat is dexos approved oiloptimum onrima light honda civic hybrid 2006syntec oildiagnostic code p04202002 honda accord wheel bearingwhat kind of gas does a honda accord v6 use2008 ford escape mods1999 honda accord ex sedanhow often does power steering fluid need to be changedferrari scuderia forumreplace o2 sensor cost2006 acura tl gas mileagedriver side sun visor replacementlicense plate bumper protectorhonda accord sport vs touringeibach or h&r springsheat shield exhaust manifoldacura b123 service costbrakes making noise while drivingturbosuperchargersllumar ceramick20 accordhonda odyssey dead batteryvogue tires canadahow to fix scraped rimstype 2 coolantwww.idatalink.comalpine subwoofers type ehonda accord picturestire rotation cost walmartair intake coversrsx lug pattern2005 honda accord ac compressor2005 honda odyssey ac compressorcv shaft cost2004 acura mdx transmission fluid changeback blinker not workingrpx900 tiresmichelin primacy mxv4 vs mxm4acura tsx rear spoilerhonda accord aux5500k hidauto transmission additiveswhat's the difference between 5w20 and 5w30honda accord vs toyota corollaacura tl seatsfender edge trimtransponder key cuttinghonda replica wheelsmobil synthetic blend oilhow to blackout my tail lightshybrid audio 6x9tire steel belt showingcatalytic converter honda civic 20006th gen honda accord modsautocraft battery gold1998 honda accord recall2002 honda accord cold air intakeblower motor works sometimes